"At Bad Attitude, we have one goal.
To make you the safest and
most proficient
pilot you can be."

This is "Old School" flight and ground training.
You will work hard and the results will justify your efforts.

"Bad Attitude offers discounted training for:
Active or retired military, crew or group (2 or more) & return customers"

Operating out of Youngstown Elser Metro Airport (4G4), we offer a variety of courses designed to dramatically
increase your skill and confidence in the cockpit. Bad Attitude has been selected as the upset recovery training provider for
Kent State University School of Aeronautics & Eclipse Jet.

Spin Training & Endorsements
8KCAB Super Decathlon - $500

Pilot Confidence

3 Hour Ground & 1.5 Hour Flight - $500


8KCAB Super Decathlon - $1,500
3 Hour Ground & 5 Hour Flight

Introduction to

8KCAB Super Decathlon - $260
2 Hour Ground & 1.0 Hour Flight

Upset Recovery Training
8KCAB Super Decathlon

Initial Upset Training
Single/Multi-Engine Prop - $1,500
10 Hour Ground & 3 Hour Flight

Swept/Straight Wing Jet - $2,500
17 Hour Ground & 3 Hour Flight

Basic Aerobatics - $1,500
Spin, Loop and Roll

Recurrent Upset Training
Single/Multi-Engine Prop - $500
4 Hour Ground & 1.5 Hour Flight

Swept/Straight Wing Jet - $500
4 Hour Ground & 1.5 Hour Flight


John Dye


Master Aerobatic Instructor (x4)
Type rated: B727, B737, B757, B767, A319, A320, BA3100
Flight Engineer: Turbojet
Designated Pilot Examiner CLE-25
Current B757/767 Captain for legacy carrier
Approved upset training provider: Eclipse Jet
27,000+ hours in over 50 different aircraft
Faculty Aeronautics Kent State University
38+ years teaching experience
Air Venture 2013, 2014, 2015, 2016, FAA Upset Recovery Presentations
Kent State Disinguished Alumni Award; School of Technology 2004
Kent State University, Aerospace Technology 1979

Bill Shugart


Master Aerobatic Instructor
Gold Seal Flight Instructor
Type rated: B727, BE1900
First Officer B757
Flight Engineer: Turbojet
Advanced Ground Instructor
11,000+ hours
Youngstown State-Business, Marketing

Tyler Khan


Master Aerobatic Instructor
3700+ hours
Kent State University-Aeronautics


"One of the coolest and best thigs I have ever done in aviation!
After completing the Upset Recovery Training (URT) course at Bat Attitude Aviator Training Company, I feel incredibly more confident in my flying skills and abilities. Most of the places I had come across in the past all seemed to be a little bit of ground school, and a short aerobatic ride. Bad Attitude and John Dye, actually taught me why we “unload” and then you go out and actually do it… over and over again! Not only do you get the feel of what it looks like, feels like, sounds like and maybe even tastes like) I was salivating because it was a real challenge!), but they teach you aerodynamically what is going on. They provide case studies of accidents, and incidents that have happened where quite possibly the proper training could have saved lives. It was a wakeup call to me, yet again, to see professional flight crews get into hairy situations, and to realize it would be easy to have the same response without proper training. There was no “arm chair quarterbacking” so to speak, but the case studies were presented in a way that says,” Hey! Wake up! This could happen to you!”

If there is any doubt in your mind, why John is so passionate about this URT course, after about 15 minutes into your first hop you will see why. I walked away very humbled, but also very enlightened by what I saw. I have never been one that feels infallible in a play, but this course made me realize even with well over ten-thousand hours in the air, in planes from BE-77 Skippers up to boening 737’s, and a lot of others in between, there was a lot I have not seen.

As the flying portion continues, you’ll find yourself learning, competing with yourself and honestly having a blast learning things that may save your life, your passengers lives, your crew’s lives, and save the aircraft.

In closing, John does a great job teaching the ground school course. Some or all of it may be review, but the presentation is like none I have ever seen. That says a lot since I have been going through Airline ground schools for over 17 years! Then the flying portion utterly priceless. I will definitely be doing more courses with John and Bad Attitude, including a tailwheel course, and then into aerobatics!"

Eddie Seddon | B737 First Officer United Airlines

"I did both Upset Recovery training and Spin, Loop, Roll training. I have only good words for all the instructors at Bad Attitude. Learn aerobatics correctly with Bad Attitude, instead of learning it the wrong/hard way. Thanks to John, Bill and Tyler."
Tim Boger | N12ZP

"I had a wonderful experience earning my Tailwheel Endorsement with Bad Attitude LLC at Salem Airpark. John provided me excellent ground instruction on the theory and aerodynamics of conventional gear flying as well as clear and thorough supporting materials for me to take home and study. Tyler was a rock star in their immaculate 8KCAB Super Decathlon. Tyler's concise, easygoing, and patient approach to flight instruction can NOT be overvalued. In my many years and 8500 hours of flying I rank my experiences with both John and Tyler among my top 5. I can't thank John and Tyler enough for an excellent flight training experience, and I look forward to working with Bad Attitude LLC again in the near future."
Kevin Cassin | American Airlines

"Bad Attitude's Upset Recovery Training program is, without a doubt, the most valuable flight training I've ever received, as well as the most fun. Through comprehensive, brilliantly taught, ground schools, and by letting the pilot experience exactly what an aircraft is capable of throughout it's entire flight envelope, Bad Attitude's URT gives pilots the knowledge, tools, and confidence to effectively recover swept, and straight, wing aircraft from an upset instance that had the potential to turn into a bad day. The quality of instruction is incredible, the aircraft is meticulously maintained, and Salem Airpark (38D) is a great setting. In short, Bad Attitude is an invaluable asset to the region, and their Upset Recovery Training should be experienced by every pilot."
Fleet Smith | Kent State University CFI

"Upset Recovery Training has been one of the most valuable courses I have undergone during my training to be a professional pilot. The information learned here allowed me to better understand how to respond in critical emergency situations. Bad Attitude took the flight envelope to the limits and their method of training provides a clear action during any aircraft upset - up, down, left or right. If you can think of an aircraft state, Bad Attitude will put you there and teach you how to recover.

As a Certified Flight Instruction (CFI), the course material has been invaluable to helping me teach students. Before you end up in a plane, you learn in depth about aerodynamics and actual cases where upset recovery training could have saved lives. Much of the key to teaching is not only knowing how to do something, but also why. Thanks to Bad Attitude, I feel my pilot and instructing skills have been taken to another level and I am a safer pilot because of it."

Alexander Wukovits

"Being new to the world of aviation I turned to Bad Attitude with the hopes of improving my stick and rudder skills, as well as my confidence in the cockpit. After completing the tail wheel course and the URT, we can say they knocked my expectations out of the park. Not only did I become a more confident aviator, I gained knowledge that will make furthering my aviation career less confusing and could save my life. I can't say thank you enough to John Dye and to all the instructors at Bad Attitude, for your professionalism and dedication."
Cole Buttermore

"Thank you so much for making Tailwheel endorsement at 38D such a wonderful experience. I couldn't have hoped for a better experience than what I received with you. The ground instruction facilities were ideal, and more importantly I learned a lot from you while having tons of fun! Special thanks to Billy who took me through most of the flight instruction and provided the endorsement. Your calm, encouraging, glass-half-full style helped get me through the uncertainties of learning such a responsive new airplane and stick! Even when I was quick to point out my faults in maneuvers, you were quick to counter with my successes. I also really appreciated your scheduling flexibility to accommodate the limited time I had available to attain the endorsement."
Barara Krizek

"Last week I did a biannual flight review with your instructor Tyler Khan. It was one of the most pleasant and informative flight training events that I have gone through. Mr. Khan was professional, informative, and a skilled master of upset recovery instruction. At no time did I feel like he was "showing me up" or trying to push me into an uncomfortable position. In my limited aviation experience, Mr. Khan has been one of the best instructors I've received instruction from. I have walked away feeling more confident in my abilities as a pilot. Your company provided a safe experience from instructor to aircraft. The Decathlon was in pristine shape from appearance to mechanical condition. Not to mention the airport itself was a hidden jewel of grass roots flying."
John Von Kaenel

"The Upset Recovery Training course provided me with in depth and practical knowledge of the situations and flight characteristics that are involved with all of the Upset Recovery procedures. The ground school course was taught in a very standardized, but down to earth manner. The Material was presented in terms that any pilot regardless of experience level could comprehend. The flight portion was equally excellent, all instructors were happy to work around my schedule, and were very helpful in answering all of my questions. This whole experience was handled professionally and I would rank this as one of the top flight schools I have seen."
Matt Hubbs

"Upon completion of the Upset Recovery Training with Bad Attitude I feel my skills as a pilot go above and beyond. I learned valuable techniques to safely operate my aircraft all the way from Cessna's to Boeings's. As far as my experience with Bad Attitude I couldn't have been more impressed and pleased. From Day 1 the ground school was nothing less than interesting, educational, and eye-opening. Getting in the plane for the first time was the best experience I have ever had flying, my instructor Bill Shugart and the rest of the staff at Bad Attitude, John Dye, Tyler Khan, and the people at Salem Airpark were kind, helpful and professional. I very much enjoyed my experience with Bad Attitude and feel very comfortable knowing I have received such quality training."

"The Upset Recovery Training flight course by Bad Attitude at Kent State University was a phenomenal flight training program and I would recommend it to all pilots. All the instructors are genuine about helping the students understand the aerodynamics and giving a hands on approach to it. I really enjoyed the method of teaching the recovery process and the focus on each individual students strengths and weaknesses. The instructors themselves are very motivational and look to only better the student and provide the best training possible. They are all very personable gentlemen who are obviously passionate about flying and enjoy sharing it. There is not a negative thing that I could think of about this program. Thank you to all the instructors who I have met and worked with including John, Tyler, and Billy!"

"I hadn't been flying upside down since I was flying in the Marine Corps over thirty years ago. Having sat through one of John's safety seminars I knew I would be doing myself and my passengers a disservice by not taking upset recovery and spin training. Since I had previously earned my tail wheel endorsement with Bad Attitude, I knew these guy's were dedicated professionals. John is one of the most passionate and enthusiastic flight instructors I have ever known, civilian or military. I firmly believe that the approach and technique in training pilots to prepare for that one bad day will arm them with the right skills to survive. I would recommend any of the Bad Attitude training without any reservation for every type of aviator - light sport to ATP. The spin training and URT can save your life and the tail wheel training not only opens the door to new flying adventures, it also sharpens your stick and rudder skills immensely. John and his team at Bad Attitude are top notch professionals who actually care about the successful outcome of your training. There may come a time when your life might depend on it."

"Bad Attitude's tail wheel training program transformed me from a sloppy private pilot with some bad habits to a safe aviator with stick and rudder skills. I had to work very hard to earn my endorsement and I learned more during my tail wheel training than I had learned from all my previous instructors combined. If everyone went through this training from the beginning, there would be far less sad and tragic accidents because most pilots only fly in a tiny comfort zone and do not know how to use the full capability of the airplane. While I was in training an instructor who was recently trained by Bad Attitude called to report that he had a close call with a student and he gave John's training credit for saving their lives. Make it happen, don't let it happen...the life you save may be your own!"

"I have nothing but praise to offer for the guy's at Bad Attitude "Aviator" Training Company. I came into the tail wheel program a low-time private pilot, but left with a much greater sense of confidence in my ability as an "aviator". Both John and Billy were among the most professional and effective instructors I've ever had the pleasure of flying with. Both on the ground and in the airplane, not a second was wasted as we made the best use of the available time. As a full time student working two jobs, I appreciated the flexibility the guy's offered in creating a training schedule. I feel like I learned more about the pure "stick and rudder" essence of flying in my time with Bad Attitude than in all my previous training."

"Invaluable training that will save your life if the occasion occurs! URT at Bad Attitude is accomplished with a team of highly skilled, professional instructors. They are extremely passionate and sincere in training any level of pilot to confidently and skillfully recover from an upset attitude. Recurrent URT at Bad Attitude is forever on my checklist."

"I recently had the great pleasure to attend your upset training course with my son, as well as my father. The upset training that we received from you was invaluable. I must commend you on your ability to take a confusing topic and translate information into meaningful and applicable context. At the end of two full days of training I felt confident, trained, and safe. I am grateful for the positive transfer of knowledge especially across three diverse demographics of aviators, all at one time. I highly recommend your course to all aviators regardless of their level of experience."

"I came to 38D seeking a simple tailwheel endorsement and ended up learning more about stick-and-rudder flying in just a few hops than I have in over 6000 hours of operating transport aircraft. Thorough, professional ground and flight training, all rooted in sound, proven aeronautical theory, went above and beyond what I expected. A valuable investment for both my professional and personal flying careers. I arrived as an "airplane driver" and departed as an "aviator". Thanks, guys!"

"I have used the Bad Attitude Aviator Training Company to get both my tailwheel and spin endorsements. My experience was excellent. If you are looking for a rubber stamp, you will not get it here. If you really want to improve your knowledge and flying skill, these guys are tremendous! I am really glad that I had the opportunity to work with them and I will continue to do so in the future."

"As a veteran of 57 years in the aviation business with 11,000 hours both civilian and military I consider myself very fortunate to have had many good flight instructors. I rank Mr. John Dye at the very top of the list. I thoroughly enjoyed my aerobatic training with John. That training has made me a safer and more competent pilot. I highly recommend Bad Attitude."

"Overall it has been the best flying experience that I have had to date. I have no doubt that anyone that goes through the tailwheel or upset training will not regret it and become a better pilot with more confidence in their abilities."

"If you are just starting to fly or you have been flying for years you already know it's all about training. If you have never flown your plane to its limit then you don't know what its capable of, good or bad. The guys at Bad Attitude can push your pilot skill set to the limits, test your skills before the airplane can test you! If you want to see what your limits are or want to sharpen your skill set then just fly with one of these pros!"

"Bad Attitude is simply great training! I took the basic aerobatic course to brush-up on some old skills and have some fun. I really liked the structure of the course; ground school, pre/post flight briefings and specific flight tasks. Professional, instructive, and enjoyable throughout. John Dye and his team of instructors are enthusiastic, knowledgeable and extremely competent. I highly recommend Bad Attitude to any pilot desiring to improve his/her skills."



Easy Access from the Cleveland, Youngstown and Pittsburgh areas.

Aerobatic and Upset Recovery training flights are conducted in our FAA Waivered Aerobatic Practice Area. All flights are NOTAM'ed with traffic advisories provided by the Youngstown ATC facility.

We Provide...
All training materials are provided for each Bad Attitude course. Copies can be made after the debrief for your personal use and review.

Instructor Corner

Both of my daughters play softball and the one thing that they've learned throughout the years of playing is the fact that if you're afraid of the ball you WILL get hurt. That usually holds true in any sport and to some degree in flying. A fear of stalls and spins is usually a good excuse to avoid them but in no way guarantees your safety. The current stall / spin avoidance decree used today is a convenient avoidance of the truth, which is most pilots let alone flight instructors are afraid of and lack the knowledge of stalls and spins. One of the arguments against spin training is that regardless of your ability to recover from a spin, most spins occur too low for recovery, making spin training useless. The fact remains that spins are not random events, airplanes don't spin by themselves. They are a pilot driven process and there are a number of warning signs. The hallmark of upset recovery training is awareness, recognition, avoidance and a recovery procedure that becomes a trained response. Although simply going up and doing spins in an airplane has value in that you are being exposed to certain flight regimes and attitudes that you may have never seen, academic training is the first and most import step in any type of spin or aircraft upset training. The academic training is a core element that is critical to developing the skills required to recover your aircraft from an upset condition. As stated before spins are not random events, there are certain ingredients necessary to spin an airplane. Through proper scenario based training the warning signs that lead to a spin become easy to recognize. Stall warning indicators and horns are good, AOA indicators are even better, but the leading cause of most stall / spin accidents is distraction. What's the first sense to go when faced with multiple distractions or being overloaded in a cockpit? The sense of hearing, so regardless of a horn going off or even a voice saying "angle, angle" or "push, push" you may not see or hear it. Ultimately the most effective way to avoid accidental stalls or spins is to either stay on the ground or get spin training.

A great instructor once told me that there is a big difference between average airplane drivers and true aviators. The difference lies in not only in the way you fly but in the way that you think. This type of instruction not only gives you the knowledge to be aware of and recognize the warning signs but will also help you make decisions to avoid the situations leading to inadvertent stalls or spins. Here are a few statements and questions to provoke some thought and test your knowledge.

Does this statement apply to you?
"I am uncomfortable flying alone or practicing stalls alone because I did not receive a lot of training dealing with stalls and spins. Actually the only stall training I received was done the day before my check ride."

Who is at most risk of a stall / spin accident? Better yet which one of these groups has the best accident record when it comes to stall / spin accidents?

  1. Student Pilots
  2. Airline Transport Pilots
  3. Private through Commercial Pilots (this includes aircraft with a CFI onboard)

Just don't let your airspeed get below a safe value and stalls are not a problem.
  1. True
  2. False

Which condition has the LEAST potential to spin an airplane?
  1. Skidding
  2. Coordinated Flight
  3. Slipping

"I was instructed that as long as you keep your bank less than 30 degrees in the traffic pattern you will be safe from stalling or spinning. Is that true?"

In a spin the ball in your turn coordinator is a reliable indicator of which rudder you should use to recover from the spin.
  1. True
  2. False

Stalls alone cause spins.
  1. True
  2. False
Adding power will keep you safe from stalling.
  1. True
  2. False
In a spin there are pro-spin control inputs and anti-spin control inputs, what affect does adding power have in a spin?

Is it possible to fly your aircraft, "not stalled", below the published stall speed?

How do you aggravate a stall and just what is autorotation?

If any of these statements apply to you or if any of these questions do not make sense to you then you may want to think about spin training. Regardless of who you go to for this type of training make sure they are qualified to teach spins. Believe it or not, not all CFIs are capable of teaching spins or upset recovery. The first step is finding a qualified school or instructor that uses the proper equipment, airplane and parachutes. Next, get educated! Academics are the first step in any properly delivered training program, then the hard work in the classroom will pay off when it comes to the fun stuff, flying the airplane!

"Death, natures way of telling you to watch your AOA."

Billy Shugart
Master Aerobatic Insturctor


Main Office
Youngstown Elser Metro Airport (4G4)
10800 Sharrott Road,
North Lima, OH 44452

Phone Numbers
John Dye (216) 832-4733
Billy Shugart (330) 540-4411
Tyler Khan (412) 389-1359

John Dye
Billy Shugart
Tyler Khan

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